♫Life's not a song. Life isn't bliss, life is just this, it's living. You'll get along, The pain that you feel, you only can heal by living. You have to go on living.♪
no religion does not cause war. ever. religion motivates it, and masks it and disguises them as something noble and spiritual, so that underlings will fight those wars. that makes it inherently bad. (religion, not simple spirituality) but no worse than government. period.
No amount of you saying "ever" or "period" will make you right. Religion is a factor in several war, but yes, it is rarely if ever the sole cause of it. I completely agree that religion is good for justifying a war, making it noble and spiritual and whatnot, but saying that government, as in all government, does the same is a tad naive from my perspective.
Most religions are based on the same underpinnings of faith, mysterianism and foolishness, which are in themselves bad for you. Government is a different kind of animal. There are many of the same controlling elements, yes, but it is inherently different to religion. One might see nationalism as a different kind of religious fundamentalism, with a more government slant - "anything my country/government does is right, no matter what!" - which is quite bad too, I'll agree.
Where's the difference between a factor, a motivator, a cause, and influence etc.? That actual "cause" for a war is rarely just one thing, there are many things playing a part to heighten the tension, religion being one of those. The cause is not merely "the last straw", like the assassination of Franz Ferdinand that sparked WWI.
money, power, territory, control (and the backlash of those oppressed by power and control) are the CAUSES of war. religion is simply the motivator. and the means used to manipulate underlings into fighting the wars. religion= a means for control. power is the ends, money is power and territory is money.
So? Religion is as much an instigator as anything else. You can make steps back and find a cause for most things as something more basic. Two opposed religions can easily be the sole reason for a war, but there are often many factors as you yourself point out: power, territory, money. My point was that religion is one of the causes for war, "a cause" instead of "the cause". And what point are you really trying to make? That religion should be left alone because it's just caught in the middle? That's stupid.
Usually the people in power are not stupid enough to be die-hard believers and indeed are after power instead of "doing the will of God", but wars are not only fought by those people, they are fought by all the uninformed masses who march on believing the have god on their side, "fighting the good fight", in their heads the religion is as much a cause for the war as anything else. This is something the we should actively try to destroy. If they don't believe they are right no matter what, then wars can be avoided.
Like westy says, religion can be used to justify atrocities easily, and have been many times already. Removing it from the equation certainly wouldn't hurt.
No hard feelings, eh? His post was satirical after all, and we're in the wild part of the internet, things that people don't like are always going to be around, the best way to do something about it is to go around, is my experience.
>> ^COriolanus: Religion is not the cause of war; it is inherent in the human condition.
Were we all atheists, wars would continue.
The argument "if it were not religion that caused war, it would be something else" is a bad one. Religion is a cause for war, and "removing it" would have stopped quote a few wars, though of course not all.
Were we all atheists, we would still have wars, but less of them. Were we all the exact same denomination of Christianity/Islam/religion we would also have less wars for that matter, but of course there are more things than wars involved in the equation.
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Life isn't bliss, life is just this, it's living.
You'll get along,
The pain that you feel, you only can heal by living.
You have to go on living.♪
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you all miss the point.
no religion does not cause war. ever. religion motivates it, and masks it and disguises them as something noble and spiritual, so that underlings will fight those wars. that makes it inherently bad. (religion, not simple spirituality) but no worse than government. period.
No amount of you saying "ever" or "period" will make you right. Religion is a factor in several war, but yes, it is rarely if ever the sole cause of it. I completely agree that religion is good for justifying a war, making it noble and spiritual and whatnot, but saying that government, as in all government, does the same is a tad naive from my perspective.
Most religions are based on the same underpinnings of faith, mysterianism and foolishness, which are in themselves bad for you. Government is a different kind of animal. There are many of the same controlling elements, yes, but it is inherently different to religion. One might see nationalism as a different kind of religious fundamentalism, with a more government slant - "anything my country/government does is right, no matter what!" - which is quite bad too, I'll agree.
Where's the difference between a factor, a motivator, a cause, and influence etc.? That actual "cause" for a war is rarely just one thing, there are many things playing a part to heighten the tension, religion being one of those. The cause is not merely "the last straw", like the assassination of Franz Ferdinand that sparked WWI.
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ForgedReality (Member Profile)
You can stream most of it for free on www.adultswim.com if you're in the states.
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Hey, cool! Thanks, man (woman?
In reply to this comment by gwiz665:
http://www.videosift.com/search?q=venture+bros
More specifically
http://www.videosift.com/video/Venture-Bros-Best-Entrance
and http://www.videosift.com/video/Venture-Brothers-Scared-Strait
In reply to this comment by ForgedReality:
>> ^gwiz665:
They may think they have trapped THE MONARCH, but they are mistaken!
!!!
ForgedReality (Member Profile)
More specifically
http://www.videosift.com/video/Venture-Bros-Best-Entrance
and http://www.videosift.com/video/Venture-Brothers-Scared-Strait
In reply to this comment by ForgedReality:
>> ^gwiz665:
They may think they have trapped THE MONARCH, but they are mistaken!
!!!
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^ no.
money, power, territory, control (and the backlash of those oppressed by power and control) are the CAUSES of war. religion is simply the motivator. and the means used to manipulate underlings into fighting the wars.
religion= a means for control. power is the ends, money is power and territory is money.
So? Religion is as much an instigator as anything else. You can make steps back and find a cause for most things as something more basic. Two opposed religions can easily be the sole reason for a war, but there are often many factors as you yourself point out: power, territory, money. My point was that religion is one of the causes for war, "a cause" instead of "the cause". And what point are you really trying to make? That religion should be left alone because it's just caught in the middle? That's stupid.
Usually the people in power are not stupid enough to be die-hard believers and indeed are after power instead of "doing the will of God", but wars are not only fought by those people, they are fought by all the uninformed masses who march on believing the have god on their side, "fighting the good fight", in their heads the religion is as much a cause for the war as anything else. This is something the we should actively try to destroy. If they don't believe they are right no matter what, then wars can be avoided.
Like westy says, religion can be used to justify atrocities easily, and have been many times already. Removing it from the equation certainly wouldn't hurt.
Many sifters are extremists when talking about religion (Religion Talk Post)
oxdottir
And as you said yourself: http://www.videosift.com/talk/Many-sifters-are-extremists-when-talking-about-religion#comment-910141
I just didn't want to leave with you all angry at me. So I leave with a smile.
In reply to this comment by oxdottir:
<big old edit>
Taking advice. Ceasing crying and sifting around.
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Religion is not the cause of war; it is inherent in the human condition.
Were we all atheists, wars would continue.
The argument "if it were not religion that caused war, it would be something else" is a bad one. Religion is a cause for war, and "removing it" would have stopped quote a few wars, though of course not all.
Were we all atheists, we would still have wars, but less of them. Were we all the exact same denomination of Christianity/Islam/religion we would also have less wars for that matter, but of course there are more things than wars involved in the equation.
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